Real Divorce Stories - Scott Hadden

In this episode Tamsin is joined by Scott Hadden. They discuss the benefit of choosing the right lawyer to support you through the process, not rushing and how Scott used travel to get him through his divorce.

Director of Financial Planning and Chartered Financial Planner Tamsin Caine has a strong background of over 15 years within the financial services profession. She began Smart Divorce following her own experience with divorce; she now advises people in the same situation as she once was, enabling them to take back control of their life and finances. Smart Divorce website is

If you need any help with sorting your finances out during your divorce, please drop Tamsin an email to If you are interested in speaking to Scott about how he can help with travel arrangements either for a divorce holiday of your first time away on your own with the children, please drop him an email to


(The transcript has been created by an AI, apologies for any mistakes)

Unknown Speaker 0:06
Hello and welcome to the smart divorce podcast. This podcast is for you if you're thinking of separating already separated or going through divorce. My name is Tamsin Kane and I'm a Chartered Financial Planner will speak to some fantastic specialists who can help you to get through your divorce hopefully amicably and start your new chapter positively. Now over to today's guest Hi, welcome to the smart divorce podcast. In this episode, I'm joined by Scott hadden, we have a great conversation including talking about no fault divorce, which has recently received its Royal Assent and chatting about the importance of having the right solicitor who gives you great advice on your site. And, and probably most of all, talking about travel and the importance of that travel one had for Scott during his divorce and since which has actually formed his new career. So hope you enjoy it because I really enjoy talking to him today.

Tamsin 1:18
Hello, and welcome to the smart divorce podcast. I'm delighted to be joined today by Scott Patton. Scott, how are you?

Scott 1:25
I'm good. Thank you. Thanks for having me on.

Unknown Speaker 1:27
No problem at all. I'm looking forward to hearing a bit more about your story. Do you want to start off by introducing yourself? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:36
so my name is Scott hadden. I'm a director of my route travel I'm happily divorced 38 in a new committed relationship not remarried yet and no kids.

Unknown Speaker 1:50
Fantastic. And how long ago did you get divorced?

Unknown Speaker 1:53
I got divorced. It completed just over about three and a half years ago now.

Unknown Speaker 2:00
Okay, and was it you say completed like it was a long drawn out process? Was it was that Oh,

Unknown Speaker 2:07
no, not really. But obviously I feel like divorces are about like, you know, like anything in life. Anything big. You have a period where it's this massive thing and you have to start and there's lots to do and then there's often a lot of waiting and particularly the start of the divorce it's it's it's much more mentally challenging I think for me anyway it was and by the end it was just I was I felt free from it and I was ready for to move on and it was just waiting for the you know that final rubber stamp to actually say you are divorced that comes quite became quite a lot after me feeling like I was divorced and completely separated from from that relationship and I think those two are different things in terms of being legally divorced and mentally divorced.

Unknown Speaker 2:51
Yeah, no, I totally agree with you. Actually. Well while we're talking about that, so they no fault divorce it's not called this officially but the no fault divorce bill and got Royal Assent last week in the commons. So people will theoretically be able to not have to wait two years of separation before they get divorced without any blame. And and a couple of people that I've talked to have said actually that period of separation was kind of good to get over the over the emotional side of things what's your take on that?

Unknown Speaker 3:28
Well there was I guess from a legal point of view the was the was flaming in my divorce so so we didn't have to wait two years but you know the waiting for us was a for me was the court process shall we say and by the end? I guess for me I've got a friend who's who is in that situation who is in a separation period and would qualify and the know that the no blame divorce. I think waiting a certain period of time can help some people but it can also feel like a noose so I feel just like everything kicks it's a very personal experience I think the ability to not have to wait two years for some people will be a big relief and you know two years could be a long long time if you're wanting to move on with your life and as I said some people will struggle to separate the the mental feeling of being divorced and the legal process of being divorced so I would say for me it's a step in the right direction.

Unknown Speaker 4:27
Yeah, no, totally agree. I think I'm all for no fault divorce to be honest. I think the idea of having to blame the other person just kind of agitate the situation and and not help people to separate and part amicably and and if you've decided to part company that seems a bit pointless throwing oil on the flames. accusations. No, I

Unknown Speaker 4:53
agree. Yeah, that look. Yeah, exactly. And there are unfortunately, you know, That's that's part of life, isn't it that people are right for each other for a period of time and not not necessarily for their whole life. It's it's lovely if you, you meet someone like that, but it's also you need to be able to move on if, if that's your situation. And I agree, I feel like for those people, a lot of them will feel trapped, or shall I take the blame so we can move on with our lives when they don't want to? Because there isn't blame. It's just not in love anymore. And probably a lot of people are equally not in love anymore.

Unknown Speaker 5:29
Yeah, no, absolutely. Absolutely. So we, I guess jumped ahead a little bit. But would you tell us your story from the point at which you agreed to separate?

Unknown Speaker 5:41
Sure. Well, I mean, obviously, for me, there was a there was a third party on my my wife, my ex wife's side. So she was she was having an affair. So I guess I'm was came as quite a quite a shocker at the time, although having moved on to better relationships, she sort of the telltale signs, perhaps were more obvious than you think. And I guess, for me growing up in a sleepy village and probably unusual, there's hardly anyone in my circle or my family circle that had been through a divorce divorce was not something that I was particularly familiar with. So I guess you always get married for the first time thinking you're gonna get divorced. And that's probably heightened if you haven't experienced that. So first, you know, first reaction was kind of like, I guess was probably the biggest regret was the immediate reaction was almost like, Well, can we save this we've been together for 11 years or whatever, it's a third of your life when you're in your 30s. That was clearly a never gonna happen and be was was the wrong reaction, but perhaps a natural one. And then it was a case of, for me, the bigger picture was clearly quite quick after that was, yeah, look at me to get out of there. She's She's left me for someone else. But it feels very overwhelming to sort of unravel your entire life that you've put together with someone we had, you know, a joint mortgage, who lived in the same small village, both parents lived in the village, we spent a lot of time with both sets of families. And you know, still not that I'm in touch with any of them. But you know, I still have a fond memories of her family. They were a lovely group of people. And I think that, to me was the biggest hurdle to overcome is where do you start with Stockstill feels like starting again with your entire adult life?

Unknown Speaker 7:39
Yeah, absolutely. And so, um, so what happened once you made that decision, what what process did you use? Well,

Unknown Speaker 7:51
my background was I used to work in professional services particularly law firm. So I suppose I was in unusual position that I had some friends who are with divorce lawyers. So pretty quickly after that, I found the one I was, you know, closest to and had a chat with him and just off the record as a as a friend, not not as a not as a as a solicitor and he very much took that as you know, just giving me advice on on everything and, you know, help me try to process everything and work out what you know, sort of explain what the first steps would be and how what the overall process would look like and what challenges I'm likely to face at each step and was like here you know, the recommendation was like look, you know, obviously this is going to this is going to become a divorce you know, like it you are going to start this process but don't feel pressured into rushing into getting that first instruction if you need a bit of time to process it and you know, you need to get to a stage where you can talk about it and not be quite as emotional in it not feel quite so raw because ultimately this is you it's going to be a painful experience and we need to do everything we can to protect you and your mental well being through this

Unknown Speaker 9:12
That's good advice. Did that help?

Unknown Speaker 9:15
Oh, absolutely. So So I took you know I took a bit of time not not not I don't think excessive but my partner obviously did because you know, she had moved on you know, the whole sort of cheesy saying have a heart doesn't break even or whatever she was ahead of me because you know, she'd been having an affair for six months when I found out so she was already had a coat on and one foot out the door so I had some some catching up to do and I feel it still got pretty early on still quite was quite rough and, and emotional. And I feel like that if I'm starting any sooner, it would have been worse for both of us actually. Because I just wouldn't have been in the mindset to be pragmatic about certain things and sadly you have to be you know, because You're not gonna get everything your own way as much as you as much as you want it. So it was, it was, you know, not quite life saving advice, but was probably the best advice I got throughout the whole process.

Unknown Speaker 10:14
Yeah, definitely. And so as you moved on and got to a point where you are emotionally ready to start sorting the divorce out. And did you did you both have a lawyer and you went down the kind of traditional route?

Unknown Speaker 10:30
I had a lawyer, she didn't instruct a lawyer. Right, right to the end, despite both my advice and my solicitors advice to the you know, we both devise that that's what she should do. She didn't want to, I instructed the same solicitor that I'd been for the coffee with. So yeah, so we went through there, what you'd call the traditional process.

Unknown Speaker 10:52
Yeah. Okay. And do you feel that worked out for you?

Unknown Speaker 10:57
Yes. I mean, I mean, obviously, she's still with that person. Now. They've got they're, they're married and got kids. So it was, you know, because of that there wasn't for me any point mediating or doing anything else, obviously, I was aware with them having worked in law firms, but this was clearly going to, you know, this was only going to start and end with with a divorce proceedings. So it worked for me, obviously. The one thing I'd always give any friends of advice on is, you know, your divorces as a person as you are and your relationship is, so don't necessarily rush into it. And if you're not 100% sure that that's the outcome you want. And it is easier now to at least mediate, and we didn't have children either. So that perhaps wasn't quite the same. need to have those sort of more sort of softer conversations.

Unknown Speaker 11:50
Yeah, no, absolutely. So what were the practical things that you needed to sort out at the time,

Unknown Speaker 11:56
so that the main issue was the house, we also had a had a joint mortgage. So that was the main asset, we both had private pensions, although the first piece, one of the first pieces of it gave was to suggest that we both just leave each of those pensions alone, they're both really small Anyway, when you're in your early 30s, so they're not really worth fighting over. So really, the house and then at the time, it was obviously all your possessions, which always seemed disproportionately important when someone's about to take them away away from you. And the next piece of good advice he was was right, well, you know, write down a handful that are must have keeps for, um, for, you know, um, what's your reasoning for them? So, obviously, we both agreed quite early on that anything then come from our families would obviously go back to that respective person. We had a very spoiled bunny rabbits. And so that was contested. And the route we tried to divvy up, but I just got very time consuming, particularly because there wasn't another solicitor. So he gave me the advice to go look, you know, the Thai time I was earning pretty decent money. It was just stuff. He said, You got a way up? Is it worth spending my time which cost money and your energy and effort to fight for this stuff when you're going to earn more money? What are you actually losing in terms of emotional attachment versus financial loss. And a lot of this stuff is the quiet incidentals. And just sort of just let it go. So you can just write a list of what you've lost and just set up a goal of buying that back or buying better stuff back after. So I wrote the list, we let it go. So she took the stuff. And then I think about a year or a year down the line. I think I deleted it having messaged him to say I've subscribed to Netflix, which got back some of my films I've lost and I think they're asked I just deleted as it was all just stuff and not important.

Unknown Speaker 14:04
It's amazing how vital that Backstreet Boys album seems at the time.

Unknown Speaker 14:10
No, I do you know what I feel like, you know, it's almost like the petulant child in you that, you know, the child doesn't want to play with the toy until another child does. And unfortunately, as much as you want to try and keep emotions out of it, it is an emotional process, particularly I think, when there's there's been betrayal. And I think that can you know, that was a bit I found very, very hard to come to terms of early on. And then it feels more of a loss because of that portrayal. And like, well, they don't deserve anything because if they wanted all this stuff, they shouldn't have gone and had an affair, but it is just stuff at the end of the day, and that's a process for me of actually carrying a lot less about a lot more physical things and reevaluating what's important to me as a person.

Unknown Speaker 14:58
That's really interesting, actually. Did you have any emotional support other than from your fabulous lawyer?

Unknown Speaker 15:07
friends were amazing. family were amazing. I've only got a small family and parents did find it very hard. I think to start with, they were very close to my ex wife, family a big part of their social circle as well. And obviously, so that was a big change for them. And as I said, they hadn't really had to be through it. Go for it directly with anyone. But I think I'm also lucky that I'm an only child, I guess. So. I lived in the village. So the you know, it was it was quite easy for me to spend quite a few nights there and have, you know, favourite meals and stuff like that. friends were friends of grey a lot. Lot checked in on me all the time. I got into a state one night and a guy, you know, drove 50 miles from from when was later to make me a cup of tea in my own house and have a chat with me at stupid o'clock in the morning because I needed it. And yeah, and I think I'm sure a lot of people like that in it, it shows you is it always surprises you the friends, you know, that always like, lay down your traffic for you anyway. And then there's always those people that really surprise you and step up that perhaps you didn't ever contemplate that they'd be the ones that would do it. But you really grateful that they did.

Unknown Speaker 16:18
Yeah, no, absolutely. So you did there was no formal you didn't go to counselling?

Unknown Speaker 16:23
No, no. And to be honest,

Unknown Speaker 16:26
I felt with my friends and my family. And as hard as it is a sort of assignment sounds like you know, Time will heal this, like, you know, and your your anger and resentment grows to while, you know, if someone's prepared to do that, then why should you want to be married to them? And why should you want to give them your time and energy? And it's difficult, but you know, you have to believe in you know, that time is a great healer and that there's you know, in your early mid 30s there's plenty of opportunity to to to find love again and use it as an opportunity to go and perhaps do different things that you couldn't do before.

Unknown Speaker 17:02
Yeah, absolutely. It's like the one show. So it was a what would you've done differently if anything about the divorce?

Unknown Speaker 17:11
I don't know, really. I mean, I feel we handled it pretty well. And, you know, my solicitor was great, really great in terms of getting the balance between, you know, and for Him, who does quite complex divorces, this was probably quite straightforward from a legal point of view, but it was the managing of me as a person that was, you know, really key for me. So really, I don't know how much I would have done differently. I mean, I said, I look back now and regret that I ever said, or let's try and make it worked. Because I'm glad I didn't. But I feel like that's, that's, as I said, when you've been with someone for 11 years, and you're 32 or whatever, it's it feels overwhelming. When you get told out of the blue, that it's all going to end and you're going to be okay with it. So to be honest, not not too much. Really, I think I think I did it as well as I as I could have done as I said it probably took 12 months or whatever. But a lot of that was you know, waiting for the dates in in in court and whatnot. And to be honest, I feel like what I gave up at the time, but hasn't cost me anything. And it probably saved me money with pointless legal fees and heartache. So, you know,

Unknown Speaker 18:24
no, fair enough not to actually go to court. But

Unknown Speaker 18:27
no, we didn't go to court, we didn't actually appear in court. Obviously, it was before the judge. And the he was conscious at the end that without legal sign off that it might not get passed. But so we made a final letter to her to say, look, this is our statement, we really do think you should get some legal advice, which she did, and only changed a couple of minor things that we weren't we were we were happy with. And so because it was deemed to be, you know, fair and reasonable and you know, from from from the divorce courts point of view, I guess a very small matrimonial pops and wasn't any need to go to court and there was no real risk of it being rejected.

Unknown Speaker 19:13
Batman, okay. So how has your divorce changed things for you now?

Unknown Speaker 19:20
I think it's definitely mean my career has changed massively, which does have is linked to the divorce. But I think it's also which I'll come back onto in a second. I think it has changed me as a person. And for the better. I feel like it gave me an opportunity to reevaluate what was important to me and evaluate what made me happy as a person and as I said, I look back and realise that a lot a lot of that relationship was was was relatively toxic, and I won't say that I was. I'm innocent from from all of that. And I feel Yeah, we were very actually quite different. People and my new relationship now is, you know, infinitely better and more healthy. So that, you know, unfortunately, I guess if you meet someone in their mid 20s, and get married, you probably haven't finished growing as a person even though you think you have. So I said, I think for me, it was a time of reflection. And certainly I realised I was not really enjoying the the corporate rat race, if you want to call it that, and perhaps some of the pressure on buying particular brands or being seen to buy particular things, and actually just being focusing on what I like, which is much more around experiences and memories, I don't really now feel that need to own a lot of stuff.

Unknown Speaker 20:47
Absolutely, that that sounds like really positive things to have come out of the other side of experience, which is obviously not one that you you would ever choose. And it sounds like it's made a real difference. And we we talked about on Twitter, actually, last week, we were talking about, about holidays, and about divorce holidays. So you're in the so I need to say this right? You're a tour operator. Now. I got that right. Yeah. So so we were talking about divorce holidays, and you had a very different idea or picture of, of what that means to the one that that I had say, Jonah, tell me a bit more about that.

Unknown Speaker 21:33
Yeah, well, I

Unknown Speaker 21:34
mean, every sort of step back, I guess travel became quite an important thing for me throughout the process of divorce, which actually ultimately led me to a changing career. So So travel has always been a huge part of of my life in a big interest. My father growing up was a international sales manager, so would travel to, you know, pretty much every continent before the days of the internet. So I'd always have my head in Atlas to see where, where he was going. And very fortunate that we have some wonderful family holidays together. So you know, travels, as has always been something I've really enjoyed. And at the start of the this not long after. So my wife revealed to me that she's having an affair in in May, we just come back from a holiday that the first holiday I used with the the tour, the tour operator that I now co own actually, so the holidays are so good, I bought some of the businesses that razor the razor brands can allude to. So we've just come back from a holiday to the Seychelles. And this sort of conspired, and this was in May, and in June, it was her birthday. And obviously, this was all really roar. And I said out of the blue. And she wishes to make a massive thing of her birthday, it was like a whole month of you know, celebrating not just the day and all this. And I just couldn't face being in the house in the UK, with it being you know, literally three weeks after she'd she'd walked out, particularly when she already had a Zed at the start already made life elsewhere. So you know, she'd be having a party, and she'd be quite happy and whatever. So my parents will know. And I said, Look up. My ex wife's birthday was like, a few days before my mom's, they always fall in the same week. And I said, I'm going to go where I want to, I feel like I need to go away that week, just so I'm away from this and not thinking of it all. And my parents were like, Yeah, that's a great idea. And if that if you if you have a little bit concerned about budgets, I guess, because also didn't know about money. And as I said, thankfully, you know, only child and mom and dad were in luck. If you if you need any help, just tell us what we need to pay you and you can pay us back, just do what you know, go wherever you want to go and do whatever you want to do. So I found the guy mark up who the tour operator. And he sort of answered the phone. And when it you know jokingly said you need another you need another holiday already because it's literally only been a week since I've come back. And it's only two and a half. And he hadn't long been started off on his own as his own business. So so I just went out of the blue tumour when my wife left me. And he's like, Oh, right, repeat waste. I've done this a podcast, but you can probably imagine, he went so. Okay, what are your thoughts on when I just need to get to the edge of the earth. And I just put the phone down on him. And that was it. That was his brief. And so we eventually got back in touch. And yeah, we worked out the dates and whatever. And he said, leave it with me. We'll come up with an idea. And he came back with three ideas and sketches and all the details. And I can't remember the other two because the first one was to drive around Namibia in southern Africa. And I looked at it and you Know what I could do in it? And I was just like, yeah, I want to do that let sought me out. So I was just about to buy this. And my other friend also called Scott phoned up and he said, I really need a holiday. And I was like, I'm just about to buy one. And he went, Oh, can I come with you? And I went, yeah, do you wanna? Do you want to know where it's to now? Not really. Just tell me how are you. So the two Scots ended up having this self drive around Namibia. And it was amazing. And I'm so much better that I went with a friend to be honest, because of that company. And, and whatever. And for that week, I just, I felt really free as well, like I just did, it did take that I didn't think about home, I didn't think about what was going on, it was just me and my mate on a on a road trip, it was just so different. And we saw wild elephants and wild lions, and it was just incredible. and came back and after that James jobs, and they were much more flexible on holidays. And you know, I would do quite a few trips and could go quite last minute so and you know, whenever I had sort of a hard few months during the divorce, or whatever I'd like right, you know, go away somewhere so so travel became very much a positive escape for me from not actually my nine to five life because that was all good. But just you know that that's a the wear and tear of going through a divorce process. And I feel like However, while you manage it, it is, you know,

Unknown Speaker 26:24
it is draining, you know, it's a huge process. And it's, it's time consuming. And even when you get to the stage, and you're okay about it, it's it's still, it still does drain on you. And you might feel relieved that you've got to the next hurdle, or you might feel stressed, or you've got homework to do to go through your Yeah, you know, your possessions or whatever. But you know, it's not, it's not a fun process by any stretch of the imagination. So, you know, travel became very much a relief for me.

Unknown Speaker 26:53

Unknown Speaker 26:55
since then, and obviously, because of how important travel was for me from a divorce and now actually, so much so that it was ended up what I wanted to do as a living. Then talking to my solicitor and some of us listeners, I know about the value, I think in in travel for our divorce pit, you know, throughout the divorce period. Now, divorce holidays have sort of, I wouldn't really say that quite a thing yet a few brands have tried. And I think like the article you shared, the ones the bigger companies have done it, it feels quite Hendrie doesn't it, it's like, you know, hey, you girls to Vegas, and you know, dollar bill in a stripper and all that, and I'm sure there's some people out there that would do that. But for me, we treat every customer, you know, completely every holiday is bespoke, every customer is bespoke, there's a whole wide world out there and you can do things you can't even imagine you don't even know exists, you can do it if you've got the budget or the appetite to do that. But I think the the constant for all this is that being away from your normal life, whether that's to throw yourself into a challenge, or whether that's to put your feet up at the side of the pool, or a mixture of both. It's pretty well proven that, you know, the reason that we travel so much is it, it makes it relaxes us, it challenges us there are all these wonderful things that it does to our brain, it's not just a set of great pictures, when we come back, you know, it's you absorb a bit of that culture, you perhaps learn something new, you see something new. And it's To me, it's just you know, for most people, it's a hugely positive experience. And that experience should be tailored to them, you know, because they're the ones going through the divorce and, and however successful or divorces and as I said to me, I, you know, I'm in a much better place and a much better relationship, but it's still not a process to take lightly or be joyful for doing it still, you know, it's, it's still a difficult process. So for me, there's this huge merit in doing a divorce holiday and, and actually, it's actually just a holiday around your divorce. And that could be timing your holiday so you're not delaying the process. And thinking about it and knowing how solicitors work as well. I was also lucky that I didn't have children for a divorce process, because I'm very well aware that that makes things a lot more complicated. And taking children away, particularly for a divorce or immediately after divorce can also be challenging because of the rawness on the other side. And actually there's some pretty cool tech that we use. That would mean you know, I believe we could let one party take the kids away and the other party know where they are and without sort of, you know, being involved in the holiday planning, but through perhaps through the solicitor that there's actually real merit in allowing the children to be taken away by both sets of parents with this You know, as I said, you can potentially give the plan to the solicitor so that a third party has exposure and knowledge of where they are and what they're doing that the children are safe, as I said, because I feel so many kids end up not going people parents don't take their kids away, because it's it's harder.

Unknown Speaker 30:20
Yeah, no, absolutely is. I think, I think you're right in what you say I think. And I had this reaction to the idea of a divorce holiday, like a dead to the reaction of a divorce party. And it was kind of almost a celebration that it was over an hour absolutely sure that some people completely feel like that. But the majority of people that I've worked with and that I know who've been through divorce don't feel they're, like celebrating when it's happened, they might feel relief, that that the process is done and dusted. But like you say, you know, it feels over a long time before you get that final piece of paper, but, but your thought of travelling to kind of take a breather from the process, I think Scott got huge merit. But you're right, as well about taking children away, you know, taking kids away on your own as a parent on your own for the first time is is monumental. I can't even exaggerate how how different that feels to tip the tip going away as a as a kind of as a family.

Unknown Speaker 31:37
You know, financial differences, you've got that you said, you know, are you going as a single parent with the kids for the first time? Are you taking a parent or a friend to help you all these things? And I feel for me, you know, these are these are difficult times and difficult processes, particularly if you've got got children, as well. It's something that everyone can look forward to. But it can be stressful. So to me, it's not a just a Hey, let's let's all go to Vegas and get drunk celebrate having a divorce a lot of people won't. Some will, I mean, my friend actually threw me a bar crawl at the end of it as a supplier. And they picked a random day, and it actually turned off actually was on a Saturday. And he turned up and he when they picked Well, I've actually can tell you that as of yesterday, your paperwork was signed, and they picked the data at random. It was so funny, honestly. Um, yeah. So you know, for some people, they will absolutely celebrate, but for others, they won't and and everything in between. So to me it's not it's not a it's not something to dismiss, to dismiss to the extent of just saying this is what a divorce holiday looks like. It isn't it's more sophisticated than that. It's just like and I think managing your well being through difficult periods is key whether that's a holiday or wherever, it's just you know, making sure you get out onto the into the Peak District and get fresh air these things are all hugely important when you've got this massive challenge in front of you and the divorce for many people is just the start of it for me, I felt quite I mean, I was also fortunate, I guess I was the

Unknown Speaker 33:22
the big earner in the relationship. So I was I could pay my way and have my lifestyle on my own. So I didn't get affected that way. But for a lot of couples, you know, their lifestyles will change if they're now living off one income. So a lot of people are going to be feeling this is the start of a long and difficult journey. So you know divorce trip might not even be a huge celebration. It may not even be a huge fancy trip it may just be something for them to go and do yoga somewhere on a quiet beach and just have some have some alone time and their me time for the first time in 12 months.

Unknown Speaker 34:01
Yeah, no, that's, that's really good advice. And we'll we'll put your details if it's okay in the show notes and then if anybody does want to get in touch and and have your help in organising a trip, and I'm sure that will be okay.

Unknown Speaker 34:19
Yeah, sure. Absolutely. My pleasure.

Unknown Speaker 34:21
Fantastic. And so finally, what is the one piece of advice that you would give to a friend who is in the early stages of separation?

Unknown Speaker 34:31
I think it comes down to the fact that the key advice for me for this was the advice my solicitor gave me at the start which was don't don't start the process too early. Take a little bit of time to just get over that initial shock rolling us Katya put some thoughts together. And because if you just go into this the next day you know the Hollywood movie is happy that you find out five minutes later on the phone to your divorce lawyer and You know, in reality, I think that that would be a mistake, just let the initial dust settle. And because of that it is such a big process, even if it's something that you're looking in some way looking forward to perhaps, right, because it's the end of the road for that relationship. It's still a huge challenge to go through. So just take a little bit of time for yourself, collect your thoughts before you make those formal instructions and begin the journey because once that then begins, it's it's started and you can't stall it then. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 35:37
no, that's great advice. Thank you so much for joining me today, Scott. It's been great,

Unknown Speaker 35:42
though. Thanks for having me. And hopefully it's all been been useful.

Unknown Speaker 35:45
Absolutely. Thank you for listening to this mark divorce podcast. If you'd like details of our guests today or of myself so you can get in touch. Please check out the programme notes. Many thanks. See you again soon.

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